An Interview with Diamantino Nhampossa

Autonomy and sovereignty

Nic Paget-Clarke: In the conference press kit, it lists the objectives of UNAC and the first one listed is “autonomy of the local communities”. What does that mean?

Diamantino Nhampossa: Autonomy and sovereignty of the local communities means that the farmers in their own communities are able to satisfy most of their needs. It does not mean closing themselves up to the outside world but it is to use their resources to the best and satisfy their needs maintaining biodiversity, protecting biodiversity, and connecting to other societies in other communities to share in solidarity, to share knowledge, experience, exchange seeds – that is also very important. All the communities have to be able to affirm that they have their own culture, their own knowledge, their own capacity to produce so that they can share with others. We don’t see that some communities have more knowledge than other communities.

Nic Paget-Clarke: How big is a community?

Diamantino Nhampossa: It depends very much, but our communities would be something like 500 to 200,000 people.

Nic Paget-Clarke: What’s the relationship between this autonomy and democracy?

Diamantino Nhampossa: The relationship is very much complex. The organization size is very much complex. There is traditional society that keeps traditional chiefs and they have some kinds of commonalities and linkages. And the linkages are based on blood — the name of the family, of the clan, of the tribe. They have some kind of traditional bonds that link them and there is a chief of that specific place. But there is also a new kind of organization that was started by the government, (started during the socialist period) which is also active.

Nic Paget-Clarke: What is that? Like a community council?

Diamantino Nhampossa: Yes, we call them barrios. There is a secretary for the barrio, and other functions.

Nic Paget-Clarke: Those are elected?

Diamantino Nhampossa: No, those ones are indicated by the central government.

Nic Paget-Clarke: To this day?

Diamantino Nhampossa: Yes. This year we are having elections for the municipalities, but that is only in 40 geographic spaces in the whole country. Very little.

Now, there is another level — of associations. Those are our members. Those are linked through economic, social situations in which they want to solve as a group, so they organize themselves in that way. And sometimes all these things intermingle, these layers intermingle. It is very much complicated for the common people.

The simplest way to hear that I belong to something is to be part of an association. An association has a minimum of ten people and the oldest one, the maximum, may have 200 people. There is direct benefit that they feel from being part of this specific association or cooperative and they dedicate a lot of their lives to this thing. Most of our members are in those associations and they spend their lives working in the association, joining together, discussing, looking for resources, advocating for their rights.

But the other levels are so much complicated.

Nic Paget-Clarke: The other levels are left over from previous times?

Diamantino Nhampossa: Yes. They are problems and have been messed up by colonialism, by socialism. It is so difficult to manage those levels, although, because of political interests, they are still kept. It is through these layers that the government works, or appears to be. They are political and interventive. They can take decisions in the name of the community. They are more used for political interests.

Nic Paget-Clarke: They represent the state?

Diamantino Nhampossa: To some extent.

Nic Paget-Clarke: Whereas the people are involved, on their own, through these associations? Is that accurate?

Diamantino Nhampossa: That’s it. The associations feel more represented by the people whom they have elected.

Nic Paget-Clarke: And that is what you mean by autonomous?

Diamantino Nhampossa: Yes.

Nic Paget-Clarke: And if one community wants to talk to another community, they would go from association to association?

Diamantino Nhampossa: It varies very much. It is not homogenous. It depends, from place to place. You will find a place where the associations have some kinds of linkages to the system that is set by the government, the barrios. It could happen like that. Associations are very important spaces that the government also uses to dialog with the small farmers. When there are associations, sometimes it’s easy. That’s why in some instances they create associations, which is not correct.

As well as some NGOs, they create associations because they want to organize people into groups to facilitate the giving out of goods. It’s easy to bring people together to discuss within the association, because is not political.

It is more difficult to bring people when you talk about a barrio, because people start to be suspicious. People don’t speak freely in those levels of organization.

To increase the conscience, responsibility

Nic Paget-Clarke: How would you assess the progress in creating the UNAC type of associations and cooperatives?

Diamantino Nhampossa: I think there is a lot of change. The small farmers are becoming more clear of what is their role in the society. There’s so many small organizations being created every day by the farmers themselves. We can’t even know exactly what are the numbers because the groups are created by themselves and are becoming stronger and have expression and are very much dynamic in the rural areas.

This is visible especially in this last three years because the government established the fund, a local development fund, which can be accessed by associations or the private sector in specific districts. Small associations are appearing to be the most active in accessing this funding and using it for the production of food.

This is interesting because even the private sector is being overwhelmed by the associations because individual people should be more efficient than a group of people. It is easier for me, myself, to go and get the money and implement something. But ten people are more efficient than one, at this moment. Ten are well organized to get the funding, to implement and distribute. They are appearing to be better organized. There is a history of twenty years of organizational association, of struggling, of contributing to increase the conscience, the responsibility, of the farmers in the changing of their own lives.

Nic Paget-Clarke: Would you say that what these associations are doing is an example of building an alternative world?

Diamantino Nhampossa: Not yet. We, the associations are not in complete control. They are not able to control everything, even in their own community.

Nic Paget-Clarke: Because of these other factors?

Diamantino Nhampossa: The political situation is very tense. But if you look back there has been so much change. There is a lot of respect from outside parts, government, and others, in relations to these associations. They appear to be a little bit more powerful than they used to be.

Agroecology as a political affirmation

Nic Paget-Clarke: Do you use agroecology?

Diamantino Nhampossa: Yes, we use agroecology. Our wish is to have it done in a very systematic way. We are waiting now on a training strategy for agroecology to make sure our farmers implement this principle, or way of production, in a more systematic way. Today they are practicing it because no one came to propose that they use a special fertilizer, chemical additive, or a special seed, or whatever. The danger of them changing from their way of production today is bigger because agroecology is not being put in a very systematic way as a very political affirmation of what agriculture should be for the small farmers.

We still have a long way to walk, in terms of informing people, giving them the political strength to defend agroecology, or defend agriculture as they are practicing it today.

Nic Paget-Clarke: There’s a big move to bring the Green Revolution here? Is that true?

Diamantino Nhampossa: There’s even a strategy for a Green Revolution in Mozambique. We even participated in the definition of this Green Revolution strategy.

Nic Paget-Clarke: You did?

Diamantino Nhampossa: Yes. We highlighted the negative effects of the Green Revolution in India and Mexico. We said it was very important to take into consideration these aspects and not repeat them in our country. For us, we don’t care about the word itself, which is “Green Revolution”. What you do is try to explain what agriculture is for us, and should be for us, and people are going to feel that is opposite to the Green Revolution.

We are not using the word or the sentence, “No to the Green Revolution”, but we are putting things in such a way that people can see that this is not the Green Revolution. In this strategy, you will see that it is agroecology, the strategy that we propose, that was written by the government. It is, basically, agroecology: diversity, in terms of seed; no use of chemical fertilizer; no use of mechanization.